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Panel discussion on the crisis of racism, PART 1
Date: 5/1/1962Call Number: KP 094Format: Cass A & BProducers: Public Affairs Department of WBAI, Pacifica RadioCollection: Black Liberation
A panel discussion moderated by Murray Kempton, James Farmer, William Worthy, and Malcolm X, discussing the crisis of racism in the US. James Farmer, National Director of CORE (Congress of Racial Equality), speaks about the problems of hatred, racism, and exclusivity. He says that racism is the misuse of words that mean different things to different people, and is really the belief of the superiority of one race over another. William worthy, an American journalist, poses the question: if a Civil Rights Movement involves white money, does it betray the movement? He speaks about how serious racism is in America, and that whites need a devastating event to get them to overcome their set ways. Next, Malcolm X speaks about how it is impossible for black Americans to realize the same dream as whites. He also speaks about withstanding the racism if it means one could know and fight the enemy. Malcolm X tells the people that it is ok for black people in America to fight back in self-defense because theirs is the most colonized country in the world. The panel discussion ends with a question and answer session about racism and atrocities against blacks fighting for equality.
Panel Discussion on the crisis of racism PART 2
Date: 5/1/1962Call Number: KP 095Format: Cass A & BProducers: Public Affairs Department of WBAI, and Pacifica RadioProgram: “The Crisis of Racism”Collection: Black Liberation
A Continuation of KP 094, A panel discussion on "The Crisis of Racism", with Malcolm X, James Farmer, and William Worthy. Moderated by Murray Kempton. Conclusion and Question and Answer period - Malcolm X answers questions from the audience about racism in America. James Farmer, the National Director of CORE (Congress of Racial Equality), speaks about the 500 years of racial oppression in America. Malcolm X speaks about being ready to die for liberation, and about how the American colonists were also labeled revolutionaries. Finally there's a speech by James Farmer about CORE and the responsibilities of the blacks today to do something and take action against white racism.
Negroes with guns - Part 1
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USMarine Corps to NAACP NAACP forms, most militant branch. Antagonized those preventing human rights; 1957 pool story & KKK backlash. Asked city officials to build a pool for Blacks or designate special days for them, were told it would be impossible because they would have to empty the pool and refill it with fresh water. White priest takes youth to Charlotte and is banned from Black pool in Charlotte. Monroe: stand-in protests at white pool, KKK mobilizes thousands (7500 of a total population of 12000) in a campaign to drive out the NAACP (Dr. Perry & RFW) and characterizes NAACP as a communist threat. City-county protect KKK rights. Veterans start campaign of arming themselves. Breakdown of law. State and feds refuse to help and side with the KKK; group of veterans repel the attack and the Klan backed down. No more raids. Indians clash with the Klan – Press didn’t cover. KKK uses racist courts. Dr. Perry charged with abortion – lost medical license and got 2 years in prison. Police brutality – raids on Blacks. Women attacked and police refuse to indict attacker. Attempted rape of Black woman, son helps her escape (rape trial), white neighbor helps. Defense is attacker’s marriage, acquitted. Prevents retribution, no prospect of legal protection – south is not civilized. Becomes necessary to create own deterrent “would meet violence with violence." National NAACP rejects violence, Roy Wilkins suspends RFW for advocating violence, Mabel elected in his place. One of the few interracial branches in the South. Started sit-ins in 1960, arrested – NAACP drops appeal on RFW, ACLU takes his case. Picketing about pool (started in 1957), closed pool, racists angered – break into picnic area, whites fired rifles, police at pool refuse to intercede, next day pistols, white crowds gather, US governement and FBI refuse to help.
Tensions rise, try to force his car off road, highway patrol – got away by driving into ditch. Police refuse to issue warrant – 2-3000 whites (mob), car attacks them, crowd screams “kill the n*****s”. They were armed, point 45, exit car with carbine, refuse to surrender to mob – students armed also. Mayor and mob surrounded pool. Refuse to surrender. Whites attack black community, no actions taken by cops so organize armed patrols to prevent attacks. Crusader appeals for mass protests. Feds in conspiracy to prevent rights. Asks for indictment of chief of police. Ask freedom riders to participate in human rights nonviolence campaign, pickets. The 10 point program of NAACP chapter in Monroe.
Negroes With Guns - Part 1
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same as RFW 028
Negroes with Guns - Part 2
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Industrial Development Coalition. Tax exemptions and incentives to corporations from the North who were not hiring Black people – taxation without representation. Integration of schools in Monroe. No buses to Black schools so Black children had to walk long distances even though there were white schools a few blocks from their homes. Early experiences of the Freedom Riders. Felt very comfortable in Monroe. Did not have any conflicts with the white people in the town. Monroe whites attack picket lines. Provided new understanding of conditions to Freedom Riders. RFW advised them that it was okay to be pacifist but to beware that being openly pacifist can open up the group to violent attacks. Friday before fleeing Monroe (August 25, 1961), 10 year old boy Prentiss Robinson beaten by 3 white men in town, 3 Freedom Riders attacked in the next county – one escapes by running into the woods but went missing. Law enforcement was asked to assist in finding him to avoid potential violence against him by anti-Freedom Riders, but no assistance. Freedom Riders request protection. RFW brings demands to governor’s aide – Hugh B. Cannon. Freedom Riders are threatened by white racists. Sheriff’s department brings over 5000 white racists into the town to fight the Freedom Riders. On Sunday, August 27, 1961 the Freedom Riders were beaten and jailed for picketing violations. Members of the community begin to arm themselves against the white racists. The Kidnapping Story. Phone call from the sheriff of Monroe threatening the arrival of state troopers to arrest and kill RFW. Decided to leave Monroe, not because they feared indictment, but for the family’s safety. Mae Mallory comes to Monroe with many others and media. Aim: show the “viciousness” happening in Monroe. Governor tells people coming in that they can trust in justice but Black people continually treated unjustly. Black man received a 5 year sentence for leering at a white woman. $1900 settlement for death of Black girls. Women and men attacked and beaten – assailants freed. US Justice Dept. spreads lies around the country about RFW.
Radio Free Dixie
Date: 7/4/1962Call Number: RFW 031Format: CDProgram: Radio Free DixieCollection: Robert F. Williams!
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TR-1 00-1:3 Intro about Birmingham crisis TR-2 3:43 editorial read by Mabel Williams from Washington Afro-American 4/27/1963 William Moore assassinated for solidarity with the Black struggle 17:20 RFW commentary "slick John (Kennedy)" in Cuba & Birmingham TR-3 retention of status quo in South. We don't need promises, but deeds & action; history of broken promises, they fight to save noble white blood; "violence is a 2-way proposition" "they are not upset at the flow of Black blood" "we must start defending ourselves" "it is better to die than to live like dogs" "we must be willing to suffer jail & death & be willing to kill for freedom" (7:00) 'Joe Salas' news headlines 19:15 On white liberals 21:20 Outro
Robert F Williams Interview with Marc Schleifer - Part 1
Date: 7/4/1962Call Number: RFW 032Format: CDProducers: Marc SchleiferCollection: Robert F. Williams!
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Pacifica Radio—Marc Schleifer Interview - Disc 1
Track 1
Why Cuba?: talks about trip through NYC and Canada
Track 2
Mentions going through western Canada and western US, through Mexico and eventually to Cuba. He thought in Cuba he wouldn’t be seen as a criminal, that the Cubans would understand the race problem he faced in the US, and that they would treat him with equality. The Cuban people had been sympathetic to the US Black struggle and had separated themselves from capitalism and the US.
Discussion of the media coverage of the Russian rifles found in the house of a member of his organization. RFW says this issue brought up as a smear tactic and to create hysteria. Says they also had WWII German rifles with Nazi insignia, rifles with Italian insignia, with British insignia, and with US insignia, because they got the guns from surplus stores and hardware stores across the US.
Discussion of the rifle club. Cops in Monroe gave the guns they confiscated from them to white mobs. Also mentions that the John Birch Society “minutemen” were using automatic weapons. None of their guns were automatics.
Track 3
Rifle club discussion continued. Says that if they hadn’t been armed in Monroe, there would have been mass bloodshed. Only the fact that they were armed kept the racists from attacking them.
Asking if he’s Communist or if ever a member of the CP? No and never been a member.
All movements for social justice and human rights branded communist (anyone who rises in dissent). Many people in his movement in South don’t know what Communism means. They don’t know Marx. They want to be liberated and they look for people who will lead.
Talks about racists as mentally ill and in need of shock treatment by Blacks & white allies. Resistance would have emerged even if Marx had never existed. His struggle is not a political movement, but a movement of people who resent oppression.
Track 4
On Non-violence as a tactic
Monroe is symbolic of a new attitude and era of new Black American
The tactic of non-violence will continue, but any struggle for liberation must be flexible and incorporate many strategies. The average Black is not a pacifist and has never been a pacifist. If you doubt that, just slap one and you’ll see.
Is RFW a Black Nationalist?
Another label. He has been denied the right to enter the mainstream of US, so most of his energy goes to the most oppressed class—Blacks.
Track 5
He prefers to think of himself as an Internationalist. There is a single struggle for liberation, although the struggles for his own people first.
White society is white nationalist society.
What does he intend to do in the future?
Continue what he did in NC, but on a more intensive scale. In NC he had to wage a local, limited battle. Now that he’s in exile, he’s been forced into a greater battlefield. Instead of a local campaign, he will take on an international campaign for liberation of Afro-Americans and oppressed people everywhere and unity with Latin Americans, Asians, Africans, and Afro-Americans. He wants to increase awareness about race conditions in US. The international community shocked at actual conditions.
Track 6
Campaign for Black Liberation in Cuba
Petition campaign among workers, students, officials
Wants to arouse people of the whole world to fight for justice in kidnapping allegations.
Talks about prison conditions in NC. Compares them to the Dark Ages.
Talks about the hypocrisy of the US and how the whole world resents the treatment of Afro. Americans.
Track 7
His exile is an exile forced by punitive action because he is a freedom fighter. His kids are suffering, being forced from their native land. He hopes to get international support for his case.
More on RFW’s future work
He hopes to do lots of writing, speaking, and broadcasting to help raise consciousness about anti-Black repression.
He hopes to reflect evil inherent in racist US and help US see itself as foreigners see them—as hypocrites.
Those who scream, “war,” those who scream, “better red than dead,” are fanatics.
He hopes to provide institutions to undo the effects of racism—to undo the damage done.
Robert F Williams Interview with Marc Schleifer - Part 2
Date: 7/4/1962Call Number: RFW 033Format: CDProducers: Marc SchleiferCollection: Robert F. Williams!
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Pacifica Radio—Mark Schleifer Interview—Disk 2
Track 1
Events leading to Williams’ exile
Talks about context in which Freedom Riders came to support their demands in Monroe and the role of non-violent protest in Monroe. He didn’t expect much of the Freedom Riders, because they sometimes made backroom deals and concessions with legislators. Freedom Riders were met with unparalleled aggression by white supremacists, and they were somewhat naïve (white activists who thought the law would be on their side because they were pacifists). The whites in Monroe smiled at them for the first couple days, but later their pickets started to be attacked and tensions grew. They shouldn’t have advertised their non-violent position, because it would invite violence. NAACP pickets weren’t messed with because the members were trained in self-defense.
Track 2 (Freedom Riders cont.)
There was a riot in reaction to the Freedom Rider picket. Cops were taking arms from Blacks and giving them to whites. The City sprayed the picket line with insecticide and passed an ordinance that said that the picketers had to be 15 ft. apart. The cops participated in mob violence against the Freedom Riders and Black Monroe supporters. Blacks coming from other places (church, etc.) were attacked. Freedom Riders and supporters were jailed without medical attention after beatings. Williams threatened an armed march on the jail if the didn’t get medical attention. They ended up getting it. After that, whites started passing by Williams’ house.
Track 3
Account of incidents leading to them leaving Monroe.
Track 4
Discusses indictments of Lowry, Crowder, Reese, Roy, Mallory.
Robert F Williams Interview with Marc Schleifer Part 1
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Pacifica Radio - Marc Schleifer interview Track 1 *7min - repression against them designed to crush the human rights movement…, leaving to Cuba (to 9min) Track 2 defends against Soviet weapons found in the community, lots about the minutemen, JBS (John Birch Society) being protected by the U.S. government Track 3 * 2 min "if we had not been armed in Monroe (to 4 min) Q- are you a communist? * *(4:15) ...not a communist, but every humanitarian movement in the u.s. is branded as communistic *6 min "people want to be liberated...Blacks rebelled long before Marx or Marxism" *7:30 "Blacks need not be told (by Marxists) that racial opression is wrong (to 8:11) 9:35 white allies movement branded as communist not true 10:37 nature of people to resist opression 11 Monroe as lesson & symbol of new era Track 4 there will be more racial explosions 0:57 opressor in us...more militant movement, non-violence will continue, but any struggle is flexible, not only one method of struggle *2min when fascism comes, non-violence is suicidal *4:40 average Afro-American is not a pacifist *5 min nonviolence is a tactic that we approve of, but... 6min soon the forces of opression are going to learn the hard way 7:30 Black nationalism? label to attack Blacks *8:20 I am an Afro-American 9min movement not excluding whites Track 5 *00 I am an internationalist 3 min bring attention to race problem throughout the world 7 mineven the pet cemetary was segregated, Klan leaders = preachers 11min stupidity of Jim Crow Track 6 2:50 people of the world join in the quest for justice Track 7 1min fellowship with the world
Robert F Williams Interview with Marc Schleifer Part 2
Date: 7/4/1962Call Number: RFW 038Format: CDProducers: Marc SchleiferCollection: Robert F. Williams!
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Pacifica Radio - Marc Schleifer interview Track 1 industrial commission development ***3:12 Freedom Riders (to 8min) 8min beating of 10-year old for being on picket line, others attacked 9:30 police refused to protect them 12:00 Governor's assistant - death threat 14:30 no FBI help 15min threats against Freedom Riders 16min Black community defends itself against supremacist crowd Track 2 0:41 minutemen, racists gather in town, Klan ready to attack students & Freedom Riders 1:38 cops disarm Blacks, give them over to whites 2:20 cops become vicious - spray Freedom Riders with insecticides 3:30 police participated openly in violence August 27, 1961 6min demanded medical attention for Freedom Riders 7:40 "open season on coons" Track 3 1min the incident 8:50 life threatened 11:15 heard about indictment 14:19 indicted & house raided after they left Track 4 4:15 they meant to get rid of me with charges (no justice in North Carolina) *11min justice department part of the conspiracy *15min the only crime was to fight for human rights...over 5000 arrested (to end)
